Ken Ogata did not receive an Oscar nomination for portraying Iwao Enokizu in Vengeance is Mine.
Vengeance is a grisly though captivating film, though I'm not sure we needed so many scenes of Iwao's father's relationship with Iwao's ex-wife, about the exploits of a serial killer.
I previously covered Ken Ogata with his later Shōhei Imamura collaboration with The Ballad of Narayama. In that film, Ogata created real a very human, and humane portrait of a man dealing with a difficult life and an even more difficult fate of his elderly path destined to die by a village rite of passage. This performance is a far cry from that later work, though both films I think share a degree of kind of a randomness in their occasional shift of perspective, in the main focus of Ogata as the serial killer Enokizu. The film has a strange though effective structure in laying out his life as the film opens with Enokizu having been caught by the police already and being taken in for questioning. Ogata is striking within the moment he appears on screen through just how much he pierces through with his unrepentant portrayal of Enokizu. As the detectives question him initially, Ogata has this particularly unnerving callous delivery of a man who truly does not care about anything he's done. There is only one hint of annoyance in his performance, not even regret, as Enokizu reflects on his very likely upcoming death by hanging, Ogata's performance shows the real fixation is not getting to get laid again, and just really exasperated at the notion at what is being lost in his life. Not lost as any regret at the time being misspent rather Ogata conveys the idea of a man who truly just was interested in more vice and that's about it.
Ogata's dominating feature of his performance is in a way in which the immorality of Enokizu strangely empowers the character and does make him darkly fascinating. We see this when the detectives are attempting to trace his crimes, given that he will be condemned no matter what, but Enokizu refuses to offer them any help in their task. Ogata's performance has essentially a trolling energy where he presents this refusal as the state of the insistence of a man without care or concern. Ogata has this natural state of hate in his eyes towards these men. What is so compelling about his performance though is the ease of the hate in his work, the hatred that he exudes is just what is within the man's blood, and it is just something in Ogata's eyes. An amazing bit of acting given that he could be filled with such humanity like in his aforementioned later turn, yet here he defines a man whose existence is defined by his vile nature. We see this more bluntly even as the film flashes back to his first two murders where he kills two unsuspecting delivery drivers. Ogata's performance in this sequence is absolutely chilling because his depiction of Enokizu's violence is with this incredible ease, and even a particularly disturbing naturalism. Even when he toys with the second victim, promising some kind of mercy for a moment, Ogata's performance shows this to be the state the man exists with ease. He has no hesitation no regret, he just has a vicious enjoyment as he brutally murders both men, where his only hesitation is to torture one of them a bit more.
We are then given minor glances of his childhood as a violent boy bothered by his father's weak will against the brutality of Imperial Japan until we again meet the adult man and see him in his somewhat briefly lived relationship with his wife Kazuko. This is probably where Enokizu is at his most human, per se, it's a sliding scale for him. Ogata's performance I think is key in creating that while Enokizu might've gotten worse, there was something wrong with the cloth he was cut from. When we see him maneuvering this human relationship with his wife as he presents her to his parents and even technically proposes the idea of being with her, in both instances Ogata delivers this fascinating kind of hostility about it. His performance in both, even when theoretically giving loving words to his wife, or standing up for her to his parents, is with a hectoring tone of voice and a strange kind of sinister intent in his eyes. As even in this instance it is as though Enokizu is committing some moral transgression by not being clear with his future wife or his parents, and surprising both by revealing Kazuko's pregnancy is a brilliant moment for Ogata. Again the typical idea of humanity seems ripped from his performance, rather a man whose basic heart is that of hate, as where Ogata portrays the joy is not emphasizing that he will be marrying his wife but rather the joy comes from the unpleasantness he seems to cause in both parties in his methods.
Enokizu goes to jail initially for fraud and encourages Kazuko to basically move on from him. Ogata's portrayal of this is not with this deep love of a man hoping to see the woman he loves move on, rather there is this dismissive dispassion in his voice, of a man hoping to disregard anything really that is attached to him. When he finally gets out he basically finds his wife obsessed with his own father, who in turn rather haplessly attempted to satiate her by getting a friend to sleep with her, though rape her would be more accurate. I believe the purpose of these scenes is to suggest the twisted nature of Enokizu's home even separate from his own existence, however, what we see in his arrival home is not the remaining of Enokizu's humanity leaving him with Ogata's performance, not we see something a little more disturbing. Ogata is excellent in the scene of uncovering the news in basically putting the state of the need be jealous husband angry with the situation, and the violent nature is startling with Ogata's work. There is a certain façade about it almost though, and almost at times, his eyes glance with a kind of disregard nearly a disinterest with the idea. Ogata showing not a man losing his humanity from this situation but rather someone who finally decided to stop even putting on the slight airs that he has any humanity at all. Ogata's face goes so far as to convey a certain near-bemusement in the setup and is incredibly discomforting in showing the man seemingly embracing his worst self in the exchange.
The physicality is something in Ogata's performance that deserves particular mention and must be mentioned in the scene afterward where he terrorizes his father's rapist friend, seemingly more for the money he can pilfer from him than truly any deep affection for his wife. Ogata's work is amazing though as he stalks the man, who is desperately just making promises of money while trying to avoid the man. The casual walk that Ogata brings but with this truly menacing confidence in his eyes that seem in true control of the situation. Ogata as he pesters the man both verbally, then also physically, there is a terrible command in every act. His physical manner suggests no second thoughts about it only this calm of mind of a man who doesn't mind relishing in a bit of violence. Soon afterward Enokizu goes off and we see him on the run technically rather than hide Enokizu continues to ply his trade of immorality. When Enokizu is murdering people he's lying to them, stealing from them, or misusing them in any way he can imagine. As the confidence man Ogata is again outstanding in instantly shifting his manner when he is a lawyer suddenly or a professor. Ogata shifted his physical manner to a tighter more professional demeanor, speaking with even gentle understanding towards people with a quick smile, and an even swifter disappearing act once he takes the victim's money, or worse their lives. In each again Ogata shows a man who thrives within the amorality of the acts, in the moments of stealing he changes to suit the need of a truly unscrupulous human if you can call him that.
Ogata's work is remarkable in showing the shifting nature of the man, though that shifting is only ever different facades he plays in front of the state of a man with morality. The trick is always that Enokizu makes himself seem an interesting person when he is pure evil. We see this when he befriends even a prostitute and her mother, a murderer herself, Ogata projects a man of any interest in them as he supports both of their confidence with these simple assurances. Although what is exceptional in Ogata's work is that he manages to be both convincing that he would persuade both to trust him as even still his manner is that of a man just barely putting the effort in with them. Ogata though has the power of charisma here that even when seeming slightly dismissive there is something still captivating within his state. Of course always in contrast to this is when we see Enokizu in his most private moments where he is also at his most disturbing. In multiple scenes, we see Enokizu as he interacts with his victims after they're already dead and in these moments Ogata's performance is that of a chilling disregard for any kind of life. Enokizu will manipulate the bodies or move around them really as though they are meaningless objects to them, stealing from them or moving them away from him just as an annoyance, certainly not any source of guilt of any kind. Ogata shows in these moments that even the people he interacts with, seemingly making some kind of connection, are just things for him to do with as he wishes in the end.
The performance Ken Ogata's performance most reminds me of in a way is Richard Attenborough's portrayal of John Reginald Christie in 10 Rillington Place, in the especially disturbing detachment in terms of the reflection of the crimes. Ogata's work, like Attenborough, creates the portrait of this sort of evil that is innate to their very being and requires no effort. Ogata doesn't portray any of the killings as special to Enokizu, they are almost merely something to do, just as his thievery and con man plays are for him. Ogata shows this as evil as a way of life that is especially disturbing. There is no pull towards the act, no psychopathic shift or need, just a spirit defined by a complete callous disregard for humanity. Ogata's final scene is one final extraordinary moment for him when he is visited by his father. Again perhaps the closest attachment that should force humanity to be shown from him. Instead, when his father reveals his own feelings of guilt over the situation, Ogata in contrast is beaming with this most unnerving pride at the idea of being excommunicated by the Catholic church and being seen as this dreadful man. Ogata's delivery is that it is almost all meaningless to him. The only smallest chink in his state within Ogata's work is reflected by his relationship with both parents. First, his father tells him about the death of his mother, where Ogata's performance doesn't quite reflect true care, but almost as though Enokizu is attempting to show care as he did care for his mother on some level yet still can't quite bring himself to even care as a son. The most genuine humanity we get is when his son denounces him and spits in his face, where Ogata shows the only human he can muster which is just terribly vile hate he feels for his father. Ogata shows the truth of the man's heart at the moment which is a hateful distaste for the idea of care or affection, as he wishes death upon his father voicing his only regret sincerely. That regret is that he did not murder his own father. Ogata crafting a truly chilling portrait of a man's evil that is defined by an absence of any good in his soul, an evil that could only cease with his own demise.
83 comments:
Louis: Ratings and thoughts on the cast.
Louis, are you re-watching All That Jazz soon for Scheider's rewrite.
And can I have thoughts on the direction and screenplay.
Attenborough comparisons, we have our winner guys.
This definitely reads like a winner's review. Hope Scheider gets upgraded to a 5 on rewatch.
Every time I hear mention of Vengeance is Mine or Empire of Passion I always remember how the 70's was the worst time for Japanese cinema.
Looks like we might have a winner here.
It's rare for a completely new performance to take the win in the bonus rounds, hope Ogata pulls it off.
Lovely seeing Ogata finally get a 5! Hope you one day review his performance in Mishima, which is one of my very favorite performances of all time. Although I'm a bit biased of course since that movie is my all-time favorite.
Someone here said Dourif's performance doesn't feel like the one that would still maintain that #1 status after bonus rounds. I can definitely see that, so fingers crossed for Ogata.
Ytrewq: I agree. I saw Wise Blood recently, Dourif's performance is great and has his 5. But compared to Ogata and Kaidanovsky he's a little lower. I'm also rooting for Ogata to win.
Finished Stranger Things 4, and I have to say basically loved it entirely, didn't dislike the California gang even though they were clearly the weak link of the plot web.
Luke:
Mikuni - 4(Although it is my belief the more I think about the film you could've cut down both his and Baisho's scenes just a bit more, I think you get the idea pretty quickly about the relationship. Anyway, Mikuni though does give a good entry into the completely hapless father of a serial killer. Mikuni portraying in general this just sort of befuddled attempts to deal with both his son and his wife. Mikuni bringing a nicely believable, if even humorous, quality of the man just filled with uncertainty and weakness. His best scene though are his final two both where he portrays a bit more upfront manner, yet even in these moments he still shows a man just kind of winging it.)
Baisho - 4(I mean interesting performance though again back to my one real criticism of the film is still given more time that it needs. Anyway Baisho though certainly is effective still in portraying the confines of the grays of character of changing her manner and dealing with both a fear at first that changes to this sort of strength in understanding towards her husband's behavior. Her best scene as well being her final one with this sort of memory towards Iwao with almost a nostalgia manner that delivers this sense of a long history even if a very problematic one.)
Miyako - 3.5(Moving in portraying the good hearted though sickly woman who unlike most seems to be just trying her best rather purely and is particularly moving in some of her reactionary moments especially.)
Ogawa - 3.5(A good performance in terms of creating contrast from Baisho's in creating another woman attempting to find some sort of person of solace that seems to lead from one brutal slap in the face after another, both literally and figuratively. Her work though in moving in showing always the very human need in the victim even the victim coming from already bad circumstances.)
Kiyokawa - 4(A particularly interesting performance in creating this sort of sly cunning within her amorality that isn't completely separate from what we see with Iwao's behavior. Her best moment being her moment of speaking with Iwao with some kind of understanding, of course that understanding being the enjoyment of murder. Kiyokawa though brandishes though as this kind of enjoyment of power within someone who basically has been denied it through her life. Although this in itself is that of a cruel joke as there's no real understanding to be had with Iwao.)
Anonymous:
For Vengeance is mine or All That Jazz?
Louis, Vengeance Is Mine
Louis: Your cast ranking.
Ytrewq Wertyq: That might've been me. Going in to this I felt it would be a very strong lineup and when he's the only five before this round, thought there were 2 perhaps 3 performances that would seriously contend and I felt Ogata would be right up his alley.
Louis: Where/how do you suppose Alex Garland has gone wrong in his past two directorial efforts compared to Ex Machina?
Louis: Also, your 2010s cast & director for Breakdown? I was thinking that Warren Barr could be a good showcase for Tracy Letts, if you have him start from his roles in his Gerwig collaborations.
Louis: I know Scheider and Sellers are upgrade contenders for their nominated performances this year, but what about Dustin Hoffman and Jack Lemmon? Hoffman especially is one I wish had a higher rating, I find him just as great as Adam Driver in Marriage Story for many of the same reasons.
Luke:
1. Sadie Sink
2. Robert Englund
3. Caleb McLaughlin
4. Joseph Quinn
5. Joe Keery
6. Noah Schnapp
7. David Harbour
8. Gaten Matarazzo
9. Millie Bobby Brown
10. Matthew Modine
11. Tom Wlaschiha
12. Paul Reiser
13. Grace Van Dien
14. Jamie Campbell Bower
15. Maya Hawke
16. Natalia Dyer
17. Joel Stoffer
18. Brett Gelman
19. Priah Ferguson
20. Charlie Heaton
21. Rob Morgan
22. Winona Ryder
23. Finn Wolfhard
24. Gabriella Pizzolo
25. Logan Riley Bruner
26. Eduard Franco
27. Mason Dye
28. John Reynolds
29. Nikola Đuričko
Anonymous:
In a given serial killer films, films I can especially hate if not done well, I think Imamura makes the essential choice of humanizing the victims, even if he doesn't paint them as perfect souls, he shows the real malice of the crimes by showing these people to be innocents even if they are former murderers. So many of the disturbing moments are of true pain by so bluntly displaying the after effects of the impact of the evil that is Iwao. I think importantly Imamura often takes the documentarian style approach which works best for the material that is plenty sensationalized just by its mere nature therefore not requiring any random stylization and in turn finding a greater truth within the analysis of such a horrible man. Having said that, again his choice to include all of the father background is a little questionable, not all of it, just more than I think was needed that feels like a bit of excessive eccentricity that isn't true to the rest of the piece. The piece itself, with the choice in structure, is basically this autopsy of evil, that is also an autopsy of festering aspects of the society that Iwao treads within, stemming initially from militant brutality, though I think Imamura essentially examines that not as the cause but just a symptom perhaps.
Bryan:
Breakdown 2010's directed by Martin Campbell:
Jeff Taylor: Jason Bateman (To push as truly an average man in the situation)
Red Barr: Tracy Letts
Amy Taylor: Elizabeth Banks
Earl: Glenn Fleshler
Billy: Toby Huss
Sheriff Boyd: Stephen Dorff
Damn, McLaughin straight up at number 3. Compared to his previous rankings, glad to see this change in perception. His acting improved massively. Great ranking honestly except I would rank Campbell Bower a lot higher personally.
We share the same top 4, in order. Would put Bower higher and lower on Modine. I’m kinder to Mason Dye than you, but only because he was obviously cast for his voice sounding eeirly like Risky Business-era Cruise. Seriously, just watched it few weeks ago, it was uncanny.
Michael:
Well Sellers won't be going up, I had just happened to see Being There before I started this year, and he's very much firm in his spot. Regarding Lemmon and Hoffman, I will say my reviews as written probably are more than a 4 to begin with.
Perfectionist_ad:
I should note even at #14 that still is a very positive spot for me.
I liked Dye a but more in retrospect. He got on my nerves, but I guess that was also the point, and his scene with McLaughlin in the finale definitely pushed him up for me.
Glad Đuričko is dead last, truly one of the most annoyingly bad performances, period.
Calvin & Robert:
Well I will say, it was definitely a thankless role, and he certainly could've been much worse.
Louis: Damn, where to begin. Thoughts on #1-14?
Really enjoyed the larger scope of this season.
A little surprised to see Quinn and Schnapp as high as they are, but I will say their work in Volume 2 propped them up for me considerably.
Louis: Thoughts on these following scenes?
Running Up That Hill (from 'Dear Billy')
Will's 'confession' to Mike
'I didn't run this time'
Louis: Word, good to know!
Louis - I'd like to get your thoughts on...
Bob Odenkirk's acting in this scene from Saul https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4i2QgUBUBw
Andre Holland & Clive Owen's acting and Soderbergh's direction in this scene from The Knick (I don't think you've seen it, but this clip doesn't strike me as very spoilery) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw-c5qFtoOc
Jack Huston & Michael Pitt's acting in this Boardwalk Empire scene (again, don't think you've seen it, but it's not spoilery) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzonCiMbPdA
Although I was rather hoping for a Sellers upgrade, I'm glad you've made a final decision on it. Now, I just hope Kinski goes up for Nosferatu.
My anticipation for the Stalker review is extremely high. It will probably end up being your favourite Tarkovsky film and he should be no lower than 3rd in the director top 5.
Razor:
Sink - (I liked Sink in the previous seasons even if her overall scope was relatively limited in both seasons, but she certainly delivered by avoiding cliche really with sort of the "tough girl" that she brought a natural life to. And with this season they asked more of her and she delivered in a major way to put it lightly. Side note first, I will say they did quite a good job with the production delays, with her hair to make her still look like a high school freshman despite obviously having grown from there, and I will say that is also in her performance where her physical work has the right combination of an innate confidence that covers still certain awkwardness natural to age, and more natural situation. There though she is amazing then in discovering the emotional depths of the role in the season. In the early episodes portraying quite powerfully just basically the tight bottle of emotions. Her work in "Dear Billy" was altogether outstanding in so tangibly portraying this attempt to hold out still when the situation is so painful, and portraying so well really the break in her hold on herself, with both the sense of grief and very real fear coming out. She is effectively heartbreaking in portraying real the release, but also portraying this potent catharsis as well. She remains throughout the season though as such consistent potent factor by bringing such brutal honesty to every moment of the situation, and making the suspense in a way by making the emotional turmoil and fear so very real. That is of course balancing with authentic moments with McLaughlin, where by far their relationship works the best here incidentally enough when the two are broken up, but having an honesty in the shared pain and joy. Amazing work that deserves recognition...be prepared for Emmy rubber stamping Brown though.)
Englund - (Speaking of Emmy, if there's a performance that is perfect for the guest emmy nom, if not the win, it should be Robert Englund's work here. It must be said genius casting altogether, but Englund is amazing in here playing the opposite side of the dream invading killer. Really a performance built upon largely a vocal performance, and in that his work brings such a pointed heartbreaking honesty to every moment. Creating the real sense of this man completely haunted and torn about, while also fixated upon his tragedy in a way that he can't escape. Englund displaying such terrible sense of a man's pure mental decay from his trauma, while finding the sense of the decent man broken by his horrible experience.)
McLaughlin - (I will admit I wasn't always the biggest fan of his work the previous seasons as I think occasionally fell into being a bit stiff, well unlike Finn Wolfhard (who maybe should retire, maybe I'm too harsh but I don't know he seems like Tye Sheridan with a less impressive early resume), McLaughlin has absolutely come into his own as an actor. This is a natural progression he's 100% Lucas still, but McLaughlin just absolutely delivers here in going deeper on the emotional beats and never trips up. Again his chemistry with Sink finally fully coming together with a genuine power in their interactions, and he is just incredible with conveying every moment of the harrowing emotional desperation in the final episode.)
Quinn - (I'll admit in the first episode with his big announcement scene I was like...hmmm not sure about this one. Well everything else Quinn ended up doing for me, earned that scene but also just thought he was great into developing Eddie as a character. That actually started almost immediately as I thought he was fantastic in his scene with Grace Van Dien in creating this sort of honest peeling away from this edgy off-kilter guy, to still just young guy unexpectedly maybe finding love, and his whole break down of his defenses is so beautifully done by both performers it does make it a bit of a shame how tragic and short that relationship is. Beyond that I thought he realized really the guy who would've done that first scene as the guy really playing for attention in really what is a facade of an idea that instantly gets ripped from him from that scene. From there I thought Quinn was terrific in creating the sense of the scared as hell guy with the sense of anxiety in his situation, while still trying to, and really failing to hold, his brand of cool. I really loved his dynamic with the kids and even the other older near adults, the former seeing more so the guy still trying to play a bit of a part to them as the older brother, against with the others where Quinn I felt projected a sincere insecurity both in the moment but also in someone trying to interact with people he wouldn't usually have known. That's without mentioning anything in the last season where everything he does is great, both showing the guy trying to fulfill something in himself and just being wholly heartbreaking with every moment of his last scene.)
Louis: Your thoughts on this interview with Ingrid Thulin.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xsGL-vnyK8
Keery - (Don't have much to add from previous thoughts, but continues his streak as the likable goofy dad who doesn't want to be that... but also does. I will say though also delivered well on his key moments with Nancy in the season, to the point I thought for sure he was going to be a goner with how many times he mentioned the "future".)
Schnapp - (For most of the season he's good just doesn't get much to do, but I did like his third wheel energy in his scenes with Mike and Eleven. What earned the spot for me is that his three key scenes were absolutely exceptional work from Schnapp delivering so powerfully these basic emotional breakdowns that are all just slightly separated in the most painful of ways. Also extra credit in that I actually think he sold the key Mike/Eleven moment more so than Wolfhard did, in that his one main line had such a more potent resonance there then Wolfhard, where that was the best he was in the season, but still thought he was just fine.)
Harbour - (Again don't have too much to add from previous thoughts, other than just great work from him, glad they got away from overbearing Hopper, and just was really a fantastic sort of in the moment type of action hero performance really in that his few lines, and physical work embodied so much emotion and such a palatable sense of the situation.)
Matarazzo - (Again just a continuation of his typically charming work, but here with his key emotional moments added in and must be given credit in not only pulling off the ugly cry but doing it in a way that was absolutely heartbreaking. Loved his work in both moments in just really finding the power of both moments and being great with his scene partner in the first instance.)
Brown - (I will say I really wasn't crazy about her performance in the first few episodes where I think she too much overplayed Eleven awkwardness in that it seemed slightly regressive from what we'd seen from her in the previous season. Once she gets past though I did find she definitely delivered in her more expected way all through her more specific journey, and I think rightfully conveyed more so the growth of the character.)
Modine - (Definitely a retcon two ways, one being he definitely should've had a much more gnarly scar with what he apparently survived and Breen was clearly pure evil in the first season not this more complicated character. Neither retcon that I actually mind. I did like Modine here though I think part of it is I think his portrayal of kind of disjointed emotions is befitting the character of Breen who is kind of almost pure evil now but not quite. In turn I felt Modine was effective in playing around the moments of emotion and never fully feeling honest nor fully feeling dishonest finding this bizarre medium that I felt worked for the character.)
Wlaschiha - (I mean an interesting type casting to be the guard who is mysterious and helps a central character escape. But hey, he's great at it. And to his credit this is not at all just a reprise of his original Thrones performance, although as in both he is brilliant in delivering enigmatic lines and quiet yet pointed reactions. Here though when he is thrown out of that comfort I thought he really was marvelous in showing just the man and father trying to get out of the situation with some really wonderful interactions with Harbour in creating an understandable and easy chemistry with Harbour.)
Reiser - (Again just a reprise, though I again really liked how much he basically is Burke, if Burke was never lying about what he cared about it. Not a ton of him, but really loved his direct supportive care he brought to every moment.)
Van Dien - (For a part that was essentially creature fodder that she was pretty great with the little she had, in instantly creating a sense of her desperate state and making the horror very tangible. What earns her the place though is how good she is with Quinn in their major scene, which again really makes the whole thing tragic by the strength of their chemistry in that scene.)
Bower - (I mean he might deserve to be higher, although I can't help but wonder if it might've been even more effective if the audience also believed that the orderly was this truly friendly sort to really have the rug pulled out from under you. Like if he had been played with this utmost good sincerity then revealed to be pure evil. Of course I'm not really being fair because his take absolutely works, this in portraying more of a creep factor, however a creep factor revealed in a form that would be believable in convincing a young girl to follow his lead particularly in her situation. And of course he's wholly fantastic in going full creep and makes for a proper menacing villain even before going on steroids both physically and through vocal FX.)
Bryan:
Well Garland has never been a perfect writing, "Third act problems" is something evident in most of his work even if the overall work is successful, having said that Men and Annihilation collectively are the worst things he has done, and really with Men it does fall into third act problems however worse than say in the way Sunshine does. Annihilation though is bad on a very fundamental level. My best guess is lack of oversight and overconfidence, which I think can befall any filmmaker if at a certain point they decide they can do no wrong, something I would accuse Taika Waititi of with Love and Thunder incidentally. As before Ex Machina, he had directors checking his work at the very least. Then with Ex Machina, you have a first time filmmaker which typically is its own check, since most won't overreach as to avoid screwing up. Both Annihilation and Men have the manner of someone who believes they can do no wrong when the opposite is true.
Tahmeed:
I will add collectively on this season I think they should've added a coup de grace at the end, since I would find it very challenging for them to somehow make a more epic finale, that pulls the various threads together in such a compelling, cohesive, suspenseful and emotional way as this season did. They might've Dark Knighted themselves here, but hey maybe they have it in them to meet the challenging of besting this season, but it will be hard. That speaks volumes of this season which I will flatly say is the best season of the show.
Running Up the Hill - (My previous statement is to pre-face talking about this scene that essentially made me say "that is an amazing episode" at its end, because it is fundamentally brilliance in a genre work. The moment works wholly on an emotional and symbolic level of Max choosing level rather than being pulled into depression, works on a horror level of the intensity of an escape, and is just executed so beautifully with the catharsis of running with the song being so overwhelming. I'd honestly say it is probably THE best scene of the series.)
Will's Confession to Mike - (I will say while maybe it was intentional to show Mike isn't quite getting it yet, and not to keep bagging on him, but Wolfhard's reaction throughout the scene is pretty underwhelming. Thought it was exceptionally well handled in terms of creating Will's revelation to himself really while verbalizing through Eleven, and just again such powerful work from Schnapp. Also I will give credit to Heaton, who would've been much lower in my ranking if not for this scene and his talk with Will scene as pretty much was a non-entity besides those two moments, who is genuinely moving in the moment of sensing his brother's pain and conflict.)
I Didn't Run this Time - (Absolutely heartbreaking work on both ends acting wise, and just poignantly realized in the quiet moment of triumph in the moment of triumph, powerful end to a character...though I will admit I so liked his dynamic with the others I wish he had been able to stick around for a bit longer, but nonetheless totally worked within season.)
Louis: Wholly agreed on finding "Running Up That Hill" to be my favorite scene of the entire show, and "Dear Billy" to be the best episode they've ever done.
It would be a damn shame if they Game of Thrones themselves with the final season, but if they made a season like this work as well as it did...I think they can stick the landing.
Louis, is Klaus Maria Brandauer a possibility to go up for Mephisto.
Louis: Don't know if this has been asked yet, but what are your thoughts on both Robert Pattinson and Steven Yeun getting cast in Bong Joon-Ho's next film?
Louis: Your top ten Stranger Things episodes and scenes so far?
My top 10 prediction:
1. Ogata
2. Scheider
3. Kaidanovsky
4. Dourif
5. Solonitsyn
6. Dewaere
7. Kinski (Nosferatu The Vampyre)
8. Sellers
9. Kinski (Woyzeck)
10. McDowell
Luke. On the topic of Tarkovsky, I'd like to see one of his movies win Best Cinematography, but there's also quite the competition in this year, 1972 and 1962. I could see The Sacrifice taking it when we get to 1986, though.
8000S: I have to agree. I hope he gets a director win and this might be his best shot at it other than Andrei Rublev. 62 is Lean, 72 will most likely be Coppola and 86 belongs to Lynch.
Luke: Looking at your ranking prediction, I also hope that Solonitsyn also gets a 5. That monologue that he has in the middle of that sand field is outstanding.
Louis: Is it possible for Newman and Hoffman to be bumped up for 1967???
Can't watch Better Call Saul tonight due to problems with my TV, so if everyone could keep any thoughts about it as vague as human possible, that would be fantastic, thanks.
Better Call Saul: Gotta give them credit for not going where I thought they would, and then making me realize that this was probably planned to go this way for a while. Seehorn MVP (Jesus Christ she can shiver!), but hard to deny Dalton and Esposito.
RIP Monty Norman
Yup. Terrific BCS episode last night. Seehorn's totally the MVP.
I'll just say this was everything you could want from a follow-up to Point and Execution. Terrifyingly so.
I was actually just a little disappointed by the Better Call Saul episode. Don't get me wrong, it definitely was not bad, and the acting certainly was on point as per usual, Seehorn MVP and it was well done in a broad sense. For me though it was a situation of goodness rather greatness, and didn't quite hit the high bar set. In that there wasn't the additional wrinkle you usually get, and I think one character should've remained in peril longer, rather than switching the peril to a character we know will survive. Honestly though I think given how the episode goes, maybe they should've used this as the separation point episode instead, if so maybe I would've felt less disappointed. Again though a case of high expectations and not quite meeting them, rather than in a way wholly missing them.
Anonymous:
Maybe.
Tahmeed:
True, it helps that the Duffer Brothers definitely seem like they're invested not D & D who clearly didn't care after a certain point.
Emi Grant:
I probably have, but excited, two great actors with one of the best working directors. A director I honestly don't need to see any material, any plot synopsis, or trailers for at this point...which I actually avoided with Parasite and was only happier for it.
Marcus:
Episodes:
1. "Dear Billy"
2. "The Piggyback"
3. "The Massacre At Hawkins Lab"
4. "The Upside Down"
5. "The Bathtub"
6. "The Mind Flayer"
7. "The Dive"
8. "The Monster"
9. "The Body"
10. "The Spy"
Moments:
1. "Running Up That Hill"
2. Piggyback Final sequence (Or else these moments would fill half the list"
3. Henry Creel's Story
4. Bob's Attempted Escape
5. Steve's Redemption
6. Will's Disappearance
7. Truck Flip
8. Eleven Returns defeating the dogs
9. Chrissy's Demise
10. One reveal
Anonymous:
Maybe.
8000'S:
As expected with any great actor, she's extremely intelligent about film and film careers. It is a shame that apparently didn't translate directing skill as I gather from the reception towards her films she directed...something I was not aware of until this clip. Particularly given the way she discusses the differing techniques of Visconti and Bergman. Also though her discussion of her The Silence character, which again speaking towards a direct truth of interpretation.
Perfectionist:
Newman is more likely than Hoffman.
RIP Monty Norman
Rhea Seehorn finally got a nom. But Youn Yuh-jung robbed and Mando still didn't;'t get in...bittersweet.
Oh and no Sarah Goldberg...sigh
No Sadie Sink either. Didn't expect Hoult and Fanning to get in but I'm so glad they did lol.
Quite disappointed by Goldberg, Sink, Root and a few others missing out. Elated that Seehorn finally got recognized though.
As for some unexpected surprises, wasn't expecting Cameron from Succession, or Jimoh and Niles to get in for Ted Lasso.
Thought the new Better Call Saul was honestly masterful in every way. Rhea Seehorn MVP, but Dalton, Esposito and Odenkirk were amazing as well. The greatest element though to me was probably Vince Gilligan's downright extraordinary direction, which might be his best across both shows, at the very least tied with Face Off from Breaking Bad.
Emmys being Emmys as usual (aka often making Oscar voters look like geniuses by comparison), so I don't get mad. And honestly there are a lot of great choices, with sometimes unfortunate squeezing out, like I would've taken Sink over Snook and Smith-Cameron, but both I would say were deserving on their own merits. Honestly looking over the categories the one I can't help but be a little annoyed by is Guest Actor in a Drama Series, where I don't think any of the Succession actors really needed to be nominated (especially not Skarsgard), and especially not over Robert Englund and Michael Mando.
Louis: I was just about to say that. I can't help but feel that the Guest Actor/Actress nods for Succession are a bit too gratuitous.
Emi Grant:
Hadn't even seen guest actress, I do think Walter is deserving but Davis and Lathan is serious and rather ridiculous overkill. Although I'll give them credit Lee You-mi for Squid Game is extremely inspired and very deserved.
Louis: Your rankings of all the Emmy acting categories where you've seen more than one performance?
I was thinking of waiting for BCS Season 6 part 2 to end, but I realized Odenkirk and Seehorn are nominated for Part 1 anyway.
Marcus:
Lead Actor in A Comedy Series:
1. Billy Hader - Barry
2. Nicholas Hoult - The Great
3. Jason Suedikis - Ted Lasso
4. Martin Short - Only Murders in the Building
5. Steve Martin - Only Murders in the Building
Lead Actor in a Drama Series:
1. Jeremy Strong - Succession
2. Lee Jung-jae - Squid Game
3. Brian Cox - Succession (Definitely not lead though)
4. Bob Odenkirk - Better Call Saul
Lead Actor in Limited Series:
1. Oscar Isaac - Scenes From a Marriage
2. Andrew Garfield - Under the Banner of Heaven
Lead Actress in A Limited Series:
1. Amanda Seyfried - The Dropout
2. Sarah Paulson - Impeachment (Feldstein was better)
Supporting Actor in a Comedy Series:
1. Henry Winkler - Barry
2. Brett Goldstein - Ted Lasso
3. Nick Mohammed - Ted Lasso
4. Anthony Carrigan - Barry
5. Toheeb Jimoh - Ted Lasso (Huh?)
Supporting Actor in a Drama Series:
1. Matthew MacFadyen - Succcession
2. Kieran Culkin - Succession
3. Oh Yeong-su - Squid Game
4. Nicholas Braun - Succession
5. Park Hae-soo - Squid Game
Supporting Actress in A Comedy Series:
1. Hannah Waddingham - Ted Lasso
2. Juno Temple - Ted Lasso
3. Sarah Niles - Ted Lasso
Supporting Actress in A Drama Series:
1. Rhea Seehorn - Better Call Saul (Finally though really lead)
2. Sarah Snook - Succession
3. Jung Ho-yeon - Squid Game
4. J. Smith-Cameron - Succession
Guest Actor in A Comedy Series:
1. Nathan Lane - Only Murders in the Building
2. James Lance - Ted Lasso
3. Sam Richardson - Ted Lasso
4. Bill Hader - Curb Your Enthusiasm
Guest Actor in A Drama Series:
1. James Cromwell - Succession
2. Adrien Brody - Succession
3. Arian Moayed - Succession
4. Alexander Skarsgard - Succession
Guest Actress in A Comedy Series:
1. Harriet Walter - Ted Lasso
2. Jane Lynch - Only Murders in The Building
Guest Actress in A Drama Series:
1. Lee You-mi - Squid Game
2. Harriet Walter - Succession
3. Hope Davis - Succession
4. Sanaa Lathan - Succession
Louis: Agree totally on Nathan Lane, he should play sinister boss types more often. Don't understand Jane Lynchs nomination at all,
Louis: Had Sink gotten nominated, where would she rank in the Supporting Actress nominees for you?
RatedRStar:
Yes he was great, but yeah Lynch was just fine at best.
Anonymous:
#2.
I'd put Hoult above Hader pretty easily. Hader was good this season, but his real show of talent was behind the camera. Plus, not to be pedantic, his work was more... dramatic? Hoult fits what I consider the perfect example of what performance should be winning in Comedy series.
Robert:
Well without a doubt, Hoult was much funnier.
Louis: Thoughts on the rest of the Stranger Things cast? (#15-29)
Razor:
Hawke & Dyer - (Smart pairing putting these two together given how much presence Hawke naturally has, and well Dyer has far less, it created a good and endearing balance between the two. Both had less potent material overall, but Hawke still was wonderful, Dyer on the other hand I think is best at just being plucky Nancy without too much overt dramatics, as tends to falter a bit when asked too much.)
Stoffer - (Limited and a brief performance but found his reactionary performance at the end very moving.)
Gelman - (I think they might've put Đuričko in just to help Gelman, to show someone truly annoying, although again his comedy works better with the more heightened Russian stuff once again.)
Ferguson - (Appreciated her being a bit less sitcomy this time around, and actually has some decent semi-dramatic moments in there albeit brief.)
Heaton - (Again his two scenes with Schnapp legimately strong, utterly forgettable the rest of the time.)
Morgan - (Did I completely forget he was in the previous seasons? Yes. Anyway compeltely fine in his straight forward level headed authortiy figure role.)
Ryder - (Yeah...she makes just some weird acting choices throughout the season, to the point I don't know if Joyce isn't supposed to be chemically altered in some way. She has some decent moments too, but her weird acting stands out more...though not in a great way.)
Wolfhard - (Yeah, his main speech was decent enough, but overall I think his performances continue to be a case of diminishing returns...and I didn't think he was even always amazing as a kid.)
Pizzolo - (Yeah they could've cut her scenes which I think were a bit too broad.)
Franco - (Found his one note bit bordered on being funny about 2% of the time.)
Bruner - (Particularly compared to Van Dien who so tangibly portrayed it, thought he was a bit over the top both as the sidekick then the scared potential victim.)
Dye - (Writing about the other performances suggests he probably should be higher, in that its a thankless role but he does fulfill it effectively as the bluntly evil jock that gets worse the more emotoinally driven he gets, with Dye showing that degradation properly.)
Reynolds - (Okay, guess no one told him he wasn't in a sitcom here, and that the situation should have at least a minor sense of gravity. He's always been the silly deputy, but here they gave him a bit more, and he went in a terrible direction with it.)
Đuričko - (Who let this happen? This is legitamately one of the most obnoxious performances I've seen, and yes he's supposed to be annoying to an extent, but you can do it in a way that doesn't feel like such an obvious performance as well. Just nails on the chalkboard every time he mugged to the camera or opened his mouth.)
I was engrossed and moved by the new BCS episode, though I have to agree to an extent with Louis' criticism. It's a shame the writers couldn't think of a less predictable fate.
Robert: Can I ask where you originally thought the show was gonna go?
Louis: Did you see my requests above for your thoughts on those scenes? It's fine if you don't feel comfortable giving thoughts on shows you haven't seen, but could I at least get your analysis of that scene from Saul?
Louis: How would you rank the Stranger Things seasons? Mine would be:
Season 4
Season 2 (ranked it over season 1 because of Keery, Astin and Schnapp)
Season 1
Season 3
Louis:Opinions on this 1990s cast for Little Children?
Jodie Foster as Sarah Pierce
Greg Kinnear as Brad Adamson
Marcia Gay Harden as Kathy Adamson
John Malkovich/Bill Bolender as Ronald "Ronnie" McGorvey (I personally prefer the latter, since it goes well with Todd Field casting Haley, who has fallen into obscurity before appearing in afformentioned movie)
Chris Cooper as Larry Hedges
your thoughts on Jason Barry in Titanic?
8000S: Have you seen Fanny and Alexander (5 Hour version). If so, thoughts on it and the cast.
Luke: I haven't seen it yet, but I will at some point. I saw Sawdust and Tinsel and Summer with Monika recently, though.
8000S: What did you think of Andersson in both and your ratings for the casts of The Magician, The Passion Of Anna and Cries & Whispers.
Luke: All I can say is that Andersson is great in both, really. A 5 for Summer with Monika and a 4/4,5 for Sawdust and Tinsel. She'd be my Best Actress win for 1953, Setsuko Hara in Tokyo Story being my Supporting Actress win.
The Magician
Von Sydow: 4,5
Thulin: 4,5
The Passion of Anna
Von Sydow: 4,5
Ullmann: 5
Cries and Whispers
Ullmann: 5
Thulin: 5
Andersson: 5
Sylwan: 4,5
Another 1958 Bergman film that Louis might wanna check out is Brink of Life. I gave Thulin, Dahlbeck and Bibi Andersson 4,5's for that.
Louis: Your present film roles for Walter Brennan, Thomas Mitchell, Charles Coburn and Ward Bond.
So I saw Elvis. I… kind of liked it? Luhrmann’s direction is actually a major boon, because the script on its own is just lopsided, sanitized bullshit. His energy was exactly the shot of illicit substances it needed. Yes, Hanks’ performance is weird, but I don’t think I disliked him. Butler is actually really great, and for once it’s because the impression was indeed perfect. Wish there was more of the supporting cast. I rather liked Roxburgh, Montgomery, and Harrison for what little they had.
Louis: I think someone asked you a while ago for your top ten uses of songs in films. Could I have your favorite uses of pre-existing songs/pieces in TV?
Louis: Thoughts on the She Said trailer.
Tony:
Well I would rather not comment on shows I might watch at some point as is the case for The Knick and Boardwalk Empire.
Anyway the Better Call Saul scene is great acting in playing the conman act in trying on the charm offensive but then falling into near hysterics in selling his "concern" for Chuck. On the flipside great brutal realization of the sort of strangely cold, while always being falsely personable, insurance agent showing no genuine sympathy, just trying to get off the hook, then seeing apotential risk.
Tahmeed:
4
1
2
3
Tim:
I don't remember him really.
Ytrewq:
Foster's actually a bit more fitting per character description. Kinnear is a good fit, as is Harden. Definitely prefer Bolender, 80's Malkovich I could see but not 90's. Cooper definitely.
Anonymous:
Well here is a list of ten moments:
"Nothing Can Change This Love" - 11.22.63
"Pick Yourself Up" - Breaking Bad
"Running Up That Hill" - Stranger Things
"Crystal Blue Persuasion" - Breaking Bad
"Rape Me" - Succession
"Superman Theme" - Seinfeld
"I've Been Loving You Too Long" - Twin Peaks: The Return
"Danny Boy" - Fargo
"This Magic Moment" - The Sopranos
"Take My Breath Away" - It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia
Luke:
Looks a little overly straight forward visually it seems, but looks like it could be a good precedural.
8000's:
Brennan:
Lucky
The Prospector (The Ballad of Buster Scruggs)
Blind Old Man (The Road)
Mitchell:
Mr. Arthur (The Ballad of Buster Scruggs)
Larry Gopnik
Hans (Seven Psychopaths)
Coburn:
Howard (Lucky)
Jack Bertrang (Captain Fantastic)
Bert Spitz (Marriage Story)
Bond:
"Big Mac" MacRay (The Town)
Tom Blankenship (Mud)
Sergeant Farell (Edge of Tomorrow)
Louis: what are your thoughts on Bennett Miller as a director?
Lucas:
Miller's a little hard to discuss due to his limited game tape (which I assume we'll get more sometime????). His three films are similair in terms of creating this light touch in a way, though different in kind of thesis for each. Capote is a stylized period piece though fairly straight forward with the style being on the edges of the scene, with most of the focus just retelling In Cold Blood but from Capote's POV. The focus being on the performance more than anything, and the additional moments of the murder not having quite the impact of the more powerful In Cold Blood. Moneyball being a docudrama of sorts in every choice and technique as though you are just telling it as a documentary of this story, even with the frequent use of stock footage references or stock footage ish qualities. Then I've often talked about my affection for his work with Foxcatcher (other than not telling a certain actor to tone it down.). A quiet but clear vision with each, would like to see what he does next which........maybe someday, almost ten years at this point.
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